Talk:Shetland Music

Shetlopedia - The Shetland Encyclopaedia that anyone can edit

Just to let you know where this is going..
Once I get all the artists/bands/etc. moved to their new categories then this "Link Page", which is still in a rough draft form,(honest I will make it look better), will be the one which is accessed from the Navigation Menu, and any other links for Shetland Music within Shetlopedia.
There's still a lot of work to do on it, and many of the acts, and final category names will need input from James to get sorted properly.
So just bear with me. I should have most of it sorted by Saturday or Sunday. :-)
Robbie 12:09, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

Looks pritty good, old man ... :-D Saw you made a cat "Shetland Artists, Music" ... that should work with Shetland Artists, Painters ... or Photographers (well artists, not press etc.) ... or Textile (designers) too ... with Shetland Arts or Artists as a roof on top ... ;-) Islandhopper 15:32, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

... just as feedback: table looks much better than list did. Don't know how this td, tr things etc. work exactly on wiki background. It is probably "rowspan2" that it looks like that punk and funk are subcats on traditional ... ;-) Islandhopper 15:44, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

ääheeem - just my opinion which might make work a bit easier: Music pages with nothing on then but a title or name of band should be deleted and /or placed on JAS's to do list ... :-D Islandhopper 15:52, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

This table idea looks like needing a complete rethink. It won't do exactly what I want.. YET!! ;-)
Main problem is that it looks like a complete ball of sh*t on Oddrun's browser. And as others may have same screen size, etc. I'll have to try to get it to work for that too.
I wanted to create boxed categories rather than a list table like we have used before.
Next experiment.. Tomorrow... will be to take Traditional Music into a box on it's own then put the others in a boxed table below. There are several command functions that I am looking at just now which should do it..
At least the link to Shetland Music from the Navigation Menu goes somewhere sensible(ish) now :-)
Watch this space..  :-)
Robbie 15:57, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

And, Yup!!.. Looks like James will have a bit of work on his "To Do List". He will know where those odd ones belong as far as music genres.
Robbie 15:59, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

Looking good, looking good....

....and to that end, I'd probably be best advised ta hadd me tongue, but.... Just wondering if Punk, Grunge and *maybe* New Wave belong as top line categories in their own right? Admittedly I'm totally out of touch with the local music scene, but the big bad world take tends to be that Punk, Grunge and New Wave are sub-categories of Rock, rather than stand alone categories in their own right.

I'm just looking at this from the point of view of someone from elsewhere coming on to check out the Shetland music scene, they're most likely to expect Punk, Grunge and New Wave to be listed under the overall "Rock" umbrealla, as that's how you find it pretty much everyplace else. As four seperate categories I'd suspect anyone with an interest in rock in general is going to zone in on the rock category, and stands a good chance of missing noticing there are also other rock sub-genres on the table as well.

Having the "Rock" category link on the table leading to a page with clickable links to sub-categories "Rock", "Punk", "Grunge" and "New Wave" and any other rock genre which may be added in the future, would make sure all rock type acts were easily found by a visitor. JAS opinion is definitely called for though, he's up to speed on what the local acts are, and whether they're likely to all fit comfortably under one "Rock" umbrealla. My view is simply from a worldwide market perception.

Ghostrider 17:34, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

... ah, da old rock covers everything ... ;-) but the best might be ideed to sort them simply to alphabetical order ... Music in Shetland from A to Z ... ;-) Islandhopper 17:49, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

You make a very good point Islandhopper. IMHO at least, presented with an alphabetical list folks are most likely to skim most or all of it at least once out of curiosity, whereas with a random list folks will be more likely just to quickly flick back and forth over until an approximate general term to their interest catches their eye. More of a metalhead myself, and quite partial to a bit of Doro, I'm glad you guys don't keep her all to yourselves. ;-)

Ghostrider 18:08, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

Good points Guys.
Rock, IMHO, should stop with Bill Hailey & The Comets, hence I wouldn't know where to put most modern Rock acts... Except on a stage with no audience..In the middle of a nuclear blast zone.. HE HE...
One of my "To Do" things for today is to take a peek at Wikipedia's music section. I'm considering following their example for categories. Then when James gets back, he can sub-categorise those categories again if he wants to separate them further.
I think the "Other Music" table is likely to change radically tonight, once I get a full day's thinking time..What's there at the moment was thrown in quickly, because changing all the categories meant we had to get it reformed quickly, just in case some poor person actually wants to find anything apart from real Shetland Music ;-)
And, Islandhopper, the "Shetland Artists, Music" thing, was actually the page which originally appeared from the Navigation Menu. It was actually just a Directory page.
Best way with "Artists" category, will to be to either link to this Shetland Music page, or we can create any other kind of category link once you get the overall Artists category.
Anyway, have to think about work... Well actually, go to work, and think about Music ;-)
Robbie 21:46, 28 June 2007 (MDT)

I've had a browse around music categories on Wikipedia, (God that was confusing), and a few other sites.
Agreeing with advide here also, we're putting Punk, New Wave, Grunge, and Metal musicians into the Rock category. The other "modern" categories can stay as they are.
Unlike Wikipedia, I see no reason to break these categories down in to thousands of sub-genres, (If we did it Wikipedia's way there would be a category for every person on Shetland who listens to the radio).
Any further breakdown of the, now existing, categories can be left to James as he is in the correct age group. ;-)
I've altered the table a little bit, and over the weekend I'm going to experiment with different layouts, and different kinds of tables. But, the existing table is fairly simple as far as being able to be edited by someone with little knowledge of wiki commands, which is something we should always bear in mind.
Any more thoughts, or advice????
Robbie 10:15, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

... more a question: Are there more than the 1 pipe and 1 brass band? ... otherwise they might go into one "pipe & brass" cat??? Islandhopper 10:52, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

I wondered who would be the first to ask that question :-)
Because the two types of bands are so absolutely different, we decided to leave them in their own category rather than risk a 'war of the bands' ;-)
I know it maybe looks a bit daft. But, let's just leave it for now. Perhaps Scalloway or Brae will start bands tomorrow... I know it has been talked about in the distant past..
Another more important issue though.
What category should Peerie Willie belong to????
Robbie 11:06, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

... firstly I would would put him into traditional together with Aly Bain, Willie Hunter etc. for both one part of his music and his influence as teacher (Debbie etc.) ... secondly I would put him to jazz again for both the other part of his music and the specific way how he influenced the traditional sceene ... but my music instrument is the CD player only ... :-D Islandhopper 11:23, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

That's exactly what I was thinking too. But, I know so little about music that I didn't want to suggest it.
I'm actually a bit more old fashioned than you Islandhopper. My favoutire music instrument is a record player :-)
Robbie 11:58, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

The page looks fine I think, it's easy to browse and navigate, which is the main points where information is concerned. Unless, as Islandhopper suggested, rearranging the catergory links in alphabetical order, I don't think there's anything else it might need at this stage. Alphabetasising (is that a word?!?) would make it look more "orderly", but it's not an essentialy I don't think, as now with the reduced number of links it's easier to skim and take everything in as is.

On a related note, there's a superfluous "Shetland Music" link/page which you may or may not be aware of that probably should be sorted out. When you click "Shetland" in the "Welcome to Shetlopedia" header on the main page, then scroll down to the "People and Culture" section, there's a "Shetland Music" sub-heading there that's a road to nowhere, you just get the "this page doesn't exist yet" message.

Fixing an existing link to a titled but uncreated page to instead go to another page is well beyond my comprehension of how the Wiki set up works yet, so I'm passing the buck to the experts again. ;-)

Ghostrider 18:58, 29 June 2007 (MDT)

Well spotted Ghostrider. Link is now fixed.
The link had been to the old 'Shetland Music' "Category", which is now, thankfully, a dead animal. ;-) I've redirected it to the new 'Shetland Music' "Link Page".
Some tips on how/why:
[[:Category:Shetland Music]] creates a link to a category called Shetland Music.
[[Shetland Music]], creates a link to a page called Shetland Music
[[Shetland Music|Bores My Tits Off]], creates the same link, but the bit after the vertical bar is the text that is seen by the viewer]]

Another tip.
If you want to write about links like I just did, or any other wiki command, before you can use wiki things in text like this you have to put <nowiki> before that text, and after that text.</nowiki>
While on the subject of that Shetland page.. Oddrun just noticed that there is a link to 'Shetland Islands Council', with the comment, "Still under construction".... We can't decide if that is a reference to the page, or the Council.. LOL!!!!
Robbie 00:23, 30 June 2007 (MDT)

Robbie, thanks for the idiot's guide, I actually understood yun, and got it to work....me and computers don't usually get on so well. LOL

Re: The Council page, I would hope the Council is definitely still under construction, because if what we've had lately was a finished item, there surely had been an awful lot of cowboys on the job. ;-)

Ghostrider 14:59, 30 June 2007 (MDT)

LOL
Robbie 15:06, 30 June 2007 (MDT)